Put Your Ladder Against the Right Wall; How to Workout as an Adult - with Special Guest Dr. John McClellan III

Dr. John McClellan Podcast
Wed, 3/16 5:40PM • 41:11
SUMMARY KEYWORDS
coach, age, workouts, people, gym, arthritis, injuries, crossfit, years, called, spine, podcast, weight, girls, play, spinal surgeon, lift, exercise, stress fractures, basketball
SPEAKERS
John McClellan, Intro, Sam Fischer

Intro  00:01
Welcome to cowboys, not eggheads, home of the brave, not home of the fearful. The world needs more cowboys and fewer eggheads. We're everywhere podcasts are found. So tell your fellow cowboys, and let's keep the conversation alive on Facebook and Twitter. And now, cowboys, not eggheads with Sam Fischer.

Sam Fischer  00:32
It's a privilege to have Dr. John McClellan a high school friend on the podcast. And, John, how are you today? Good, Sam. And so John actually sent me a text about two months ago and said, I'd like to come on your podcast and talk a little bit about appropriate workouts for people our age. And so John's a year older than I am. And so we're both in our 50s. And he sees a lot as a spinal surgeon and one of the well the top spinal surgeons in Nebraska, if not, the region, if not the country, has it. So we're I mean, I'm really excited to have you on I'm sure somebody were talking to you today who is a very nice egg head when it comes to spinal surgeries. I mean, I can't imagine doing spinal surgery on somebody , it's got to be quite a trip. So I just thought we would talk a little bit about that today. And just talking about fitness for people who are aging. And we'll have some fun. So the first thing I got to do, though, John, is to ask you, you know, John, played he didn't he? He sat on - he was the six man on basketball for Coach Kane. And so the coach came podcast was our most second most downloaded podcasts in history. So a lot of our listeners have listened to it. You listened to it? And you played for coach did we did we get it? Right? Did that. Is there anything you wanted to add about Coach killer Kane?

John McClellan  02:04
Yeah, gosh, I was 38 years ago, I thought was a great podcast. I think. I learned a lot from the podcast. My knew coach played professional baseball. At least that was a rumor back then. And I saw the good and in the bad and the toughness and coach. I saw all sides of him. But I thought it was very fair podcast. And I guess I didn't see any emotions in it. It was more as very informative and explained who the man was. Yeah, I appreciated it.

Sam Fischer  02:39
Yeah. Well, thanks for sending it to some of your classmates. I saw the downloads pick up a little bit there. Because he sees the kind of topic that I think that guys that if they saw that on their phone, and they they had 10 minutes they press play pretty quick. Right? He's an interesting cat.

02:55
extremely interesting. Yeah, I was. It can leads into the workouts what we're going to talk about, at the end of my freshman year coach explained that I needed to do track. And if I didn't do track, I couldn't play football or basketball the next year and I had grown up golfing with my dad and my brother and that was my true love. And yeah, you're a good golfer and I and I went the other way and played golf and sure enough, coach would not let me join the team's sophomore year. So I wouldn't allow him to play JV or varsity Well, football or basketball and

Sam Fischer  03:30
sorry, I didn't know. Yeah. And then

03:33
he had we

Sam Fischer  03:35
needed to let you just like he just like you showed up for practice did not go that wouldn't love to what do you say wouldn't love to show up for the team? Because no, John, not today? Or what do you say? No,

03:43
he was clear about it that I was not playing. right, you're done. And then sophomore year, he had a couple of my classmates talk to me and as long as I ran track after golf, I could play my junior year. So the end of my sophomore year, one of my classmates Joe O’Keefe would come out after dinner and he would run with me for half hour, 45 minutes an hour and coach gave me a list of things I had to do. Joe you actually came out and did double team to make sure I did

Sam Fischer  04:10
O’. Yeah. I do know that John. I was given a freshman course I was swallowed up in that survival mode. But yeah, that's interesting. So Joe O’Keefe mentioned him he was so he was a big dude. Right? Yeah, Josie I tackled him. So yeah, he was I want I want third party credibility. still talk to him at all.

04:27
I I haven't talked to Joe in a couple years. We it's been a few years since we've had our reunion. But yeah, he was a real close friend. extremely helpful for getting my head back into the game. So I was allowed to play junior and senior year, but yeah, I had to sit out sophomore year.

Sam Fischer  04:43
I did not know that. Now did he? Was Was it just like the special track that we ran or did you run competitively meets?

04:52
no, he. He gave me a list of tasks I had to complete each night and Joe came out Monday through Thursday and did the you know the he gave me so many Sprint's and for for hundreds that we had to run nothing real over the top?

Sam Fischer  05:08
No, but he wanted in shape. Yeah, it was that was one of the mandatory things it was that the track special. I mean, yeah, we did. So you never got in trouble or had to run an 800 a certain time or the increase?

05:19
Yeah. And I didn't I didn't take it personal from coach he had his rules he you know, he had boundaries and I

Sam Fischer  05:26
Yeah, no negotiation of this deal. Yeah,

05:28
I didn't. I didn't try and negotiate. I didn't go complain or whine I didn't talk to the parents or anybody else. No, it was what it was.

Sam Fischer  05:34
Yeah. So um, last question before we get off this topic, but do you think Coach Kane could coach today?

05:42
Oh, boy. Um, I don't know. I mean, I remember during the podcast about guys getting hit in the helmet with clipboard or in the head without the helmet with a clipboard.

Sam Fischer  05:54
Now. I've been corrected Joe. Joe had several alumni have called me and set the record straight on something today. They a lot of folks had known I never had anybody in the head with you through it. But you had to duck like, well, what if you want to duck it? What hit you in the head? Right?

06:09
Yeah, I remember. My junior year when I was allowed to go out for basketball. I got a funny looking haircut. I think they call it a body wave or whatever. And for me, it came out more like a perm. And I showed up to basketball practice Sunday night and coach calls everybody over and he looks at me says McClellan, we don't wear our hair like girls, you will have that cut next Friday. I was more than happy to cut it at that point.

Sam Fischer  06:38
So that again, well, would that happene today. I don't know.

06:41
Yeah, I don't know. I and I wonder if you know, if if kind of society forces coaches to change anyway. I mean, it's if coach were alive today, I think he would have been clever enough and wise enough to change things a little bit. I agree. He was so passionate about your creating men. And that was the style back then. Did

Sam Fischer  07:03
you know that at the time, or did you now realize that later cuz I I didn't know what he was doing? I just just just, I didn't want to be called like, I actually talked to Pete Stackhouse. And my guess I can’t…?Yes, and I might say some things, but Stackhouse said are certain names that he wasn't called in his definition of success with coaches. I was never called XY and Z. And I never any I never got hit. And so to him, that was success. You know,

07:32
I think I think coaches creating men, I, you know, he, again, he put up very specific boundaries, and you either follow them or you broke yourself. He was clear about it. And one was that if you showed up less than 15 minutes before practice, you were invited to leave. Yeah. And that was on Sunday nights. There were a couple of times where we were cut it a little too close driving out there. And one was between districts and state my senior year for basketball when we when we ended up winning state and walked in about two minutes too late. And Coach said, we'll see you tomorrow night. You know, there's yeah, there's no discussion and and so it was, I think is a young man, you know, 15 16 17 18 years of age. It was nice to have clear boundaries.

Sam Fischer  08:23
Yeah. All right. I lied. One more question. Last question. I swear listeners, do you think he will? the psyche of coach Kane? Why was he the way that he was? And I I've pondered that and maybe it was because he screwed up and didn't get an opportunity to Yankees. Do you think that's part of it?

John McClellan  08:44
I don't know. I you

Sam Fischer  08:45
know, it was what made him I mean, he was in the army. I mean, what made him so tough, so tough?

08:52
Boy, I just I think back then. Discipline, hardcore discipline was fully acceptable, right? I mean, it was not uncommon for parents to literally spank their kids, you know, with a belt. Oh, I got well, you know, whatever was extremely painful. Yeah, but nowadays, you know, if you belt a child and they live in ccall. Yeah. So I think I don't know. I guess I hope some of it is that coaches are there there. There's more information on how to be a good coach for young guys that it's and hopefully you know, that parents are learning to be better parents than they were in the past. I don't know if it's, I would hope that what we're seeing now is just a slow transition in advance and training kids but I'm not sure why coaches that way and i would say i i broke myself against his rules quite often and suffered in a in a but I don't hold on to coach that I know I'm the one who made the decision. I

Sam Fischer  10:02
don't I don't I'm not angry. Yeah, you know, it's interesting. One of our, one of my friends said, Well, what are you? What are you trying to accomplish with it? Are you angry or what? I'm no, I'm not. But I am profoundly disappointed. I didn't get to play. I mean, that's fair. So

10:16
and I, you know, that's one of the things I appreciate. Listening to your podcasts, I never realized that I was a six man on the basketball team. And the guys that played behind clearly needed to be starters, they were just superior basketball players. But Coach was not one that played you just because you showed up for practice and that you showed up? He was he really from your podcast learning that? You know, the starters probably played 90%. Plus again, and I guess I just never thought about thought about it this way. Well, yeah. So I thought your podcast is I thought it was fair. It was informative. And yeah. And I think if you look at an unemotional fashion, I was it's actually a nice historic piece on who coach was.

Sam Fischer  10:59
I hope so. I hope I hope so. So well, we'll get we'll get we'll move on from Coach Kane. So you I said, I kind of rekindled my relationship with with John here in the last couple years, and I had a and for legal purposes, Doc, you're fully welcome to talk about my condition. We'll you know, we'll talk about it here publicly, but I have an L five s one herniation. And you diagnosed me it was spinal, or congenital spinal stenosis, which is a 25 cent couple 25 cent words for I was born with it. Which means that that my spine is if I'm if I have this correct, is my spine is more narrow at the base than it is, it's not the same metric, all the way the circumference of my spine is not the same at the bottom of my spine as the top of the spine. And it's, I assume it's a normal condition, but I am as my listeners know, I'm a knucklehead crossfitter. And, you know, there are consequences for for that. And I, you know, I may argue that maybe CrossFit maybe allowed me to do some things longer than what I did before the before the herniation happened. But you so that's kind of how we rekindled and so I'm sure you see lots you see lots of people our age, that have resumed some physical activity, aggressive, whether it's CrossFit or racquetball or tennis, whatever, and so, love to get your thoughts on on, you know, kind of, you know, educating guys our age, what you know what to do or what not to do.

12:40
Yeah, great questions. And I think I've been a spinal surgeon in Omaha for or in Nebraska for the last 22 years. And it's been a definite I would say a journey, seeing how people try and stay in shape. You know, I look back when we were at Mount Michael, our weight room was probably 40 feet by 40 feet. Yeah.

Sam Fischer  13:06
It was a place it was not very welcome place. Yeah, place. It was. Just it was there.

13:11
I don't remember any windows. I remember one piece of equipment. It was a circuit piece of equipment. A couple bench presses. Yep. And I think my four years about Michael, I don't think I ever lifted a weight in the room. Or if I did, it was a very,

Sam Fischer  13:26
I did because I was trying to play but anyway, yeah, I digress.

13:30
But but we didn't have we didn't really have weight programs. No.

Sam Fischer  13:35
You're on your own. Yeah, there's no trainer. You got to grab a buddy and go down there and you kind of put the other if the other program with the guy and by name a Walt Bahr or I lifted with wall barn. George buckler, you're going to me but yeah, you're on your own. Yeah. And those two guys

13:49
were very fit. I remember? Yes. But you know, to see how the opportunities for working out have transitioned now from a Dungey weight room in the basement that very few guys use or even know how to you use to. Now I mean, before the podcast I talked about I have some patients that are using the Oculus to stay fit senior citizens putting on the Oculus, it's super entertaining. Oculus is a virtual reality system. Correct. And you can put on the virtual reality goggles and you can do obstacle courses in front of you in your basement and it's just it's become extremely entertaining at the same time that you're working out. We hear a lot about the peloton. We have one in our basement. And now instead of just doing the spin bike, you can do yoga, Pilates stretches, they have weight training programs. The choices are immense. But what I'm what I'm starting to see is that in guys our age, kind of what I consider the empty nester phase, you know, 50 and above. It's just trying to figure out what you're trying to accomplish in your own life. And to make sure that the gym that you join or the exercises that you do that they're really in line with what you're trying to accomplish. And what I mean by that is, if a person wants to get in much better shape, matching nutrition with the workouts, and understanding iat 50 Your, your bodies, and I use this a lot, anybody that sees me in clinical understand this right away, but I use the analogy of a pickup truck all the time, you know, a 50 year old pickup truck, if it's got all original parts, the parts can be in perfect shape. But if you hit a few curbs with that 50 year old pickup truck, you're gonna have a problem. And if you pull something too heavy, or if you overload the bed of the truck, you know, springs will break

Sam Fischer  15:52
across a field of bricks. Exactly. So

15:55
it's it's kind of a try. And I guess when I, it's, I try to understand what is the patient trying to accomplish? Because usually they're in my clinic because they were hurt. And it may or may not be related to their workouts. But yeah, I think it's the reason I requested to come on as I just wanted to sit down and have a chat with you and and everybody that's listening to your podcast to help explain there's no perfect way to do it. But you really need I think the key though,

Sam Fischer  16:27
I mean, let's start with first of all the need to have fitness. I mean, I think it's, it's, it's vitally important that you move in some way. Because, you know, I, you know, I was at a desk for 30 years, and you're not moving. And so that doesn't do very, if you're not moving, and you're not doing something besides that, you're going to be in a heap of trouble. And so I think anybody that wants to move or exercise, if they haven't, absolutely should, it helps from the internal standpoint, your blood, I mean, my doc loves my blood work, I go twice a year, and he  goes, I don't know what you're doing. But keep doing that blood work is impeccable. It's so that's a that's a positive thing. And then again, the movement, the range of motion, you know, I don't have I have terrible range of motion, because I sat in a chair for until I was 46, and decided to do something about it. So I think it's good to exercise, the key is, I believe is number one to find something that you enjoy doing, because who wants to exercise if it's if it's cumbersome or not enjoyable, you should do that. It doesn't, you know, it can be anything. But your point is, after you find that, be cautious about how you approach that. So

17:51
it's a good point I I kind of I break it down into, there's cardio exercises, you know, which is walking spin bike, ellipticals, and then there's weight training and range of motion exercises. And where I see most people get hurt are more of the higher impact, higher weight exercises, and, and so there's nothing wrong with doing them as long as people are aware that they have to be a little more careful.

Sam Fischer  18:23
And I think that's where, from my perspective, that's where from a CrossFit perspective, there are many crossfit box out there. That's obviously something that's grown tremendously in the last 10 years. No to CrossFit boxes are the same. And so you should coach shop in my opinion, and that means you better get coaches that understand the form their body is standard for how you lift and I will tell you that in my and I'm not trying to advertise CrossFit, I'm not trying to be defensive, but at my gym, there are standards that you have to hit before they'll even let you put weight on the bar. Because when you're doing very complex weightlifting movements, today I did clean and jerks, which I don't think there's many 54 year olds doing clean and jerks with a frickin barbell, but I was doing them and that you better there are certain things you better do like you better squeeze your ass at the top and you better you know, there there are techniques that you've got to get done. And if you don't have somebody watching you do that, you're gonna be in trouble. And, and you know, like so I'm working out with these 20 year old kids today and 20 30 year olds and the prescribed weight was 135 pounds. I didn't …doc you'll be happy that I did not and I haven't since you have our chat. I back off weight on the bar. I can still get a good workout by doing that, and so you know, I didn't do 135 I did 115 See CrossFitters always tell everything you know, there's the old joke a crossfitter evangelical Christian and insurance agent walked into a bar you know, I know because they told me anyway,

20:04
I think that's a good point, you know that when you're doing a complex lift, which I consider Olympic lifts, squats, deadlifts, hang cleans, their complex lifts a lot of joints involved in the lift itself isn't a challenge. It's when you put weight on it. And so what I, what I tend to focus on in those, the guys and girls in high school, which we see a lot of injuries from those lifts, and guys our age, it's more a matter of me, for those that aren't ready for it. Can you use the kettlebells the dumbbells in lighter weights, once we get to the 45 pound bar? In as soon as you put a 45 pound plate on each side, you're well over 100 pounds, that's 135. And for for high school kids that don't have a lot of testosterone in their body, they're their skeletons aren't really formed. It's a it's a very challenging lift with a lot of injuries. At what age are there skeletons formed? skeletons are more mature, probably around the age of 2021. And that is, we see the same type of adolescent injuries in high school athletes until they hit maybe freshman, sophomore year of college and then the adolescent injuries go

Sam Fischer  21:14
away. And what's your was it adolescent injury? What does that mean?

21:17
So the book the bones in adolescence, and by adolescence I'm referring to basically ages eight up until 20. The skeleton is very soft. And if you apply too much weight to it, you'll crack it, So the one of the more common injuries that we see is lumbar stress fracture. And in most of the boys and girls, they don't heal, so they're left with permanent fractures in their back. extremely common. And we've seen boys and girls with up to seven fractures in their back. So it's as now in adults, the difference is you don't develop stress fractures. But in a 50 year old spine that does a squat, a deadlift and a hang clean. At the age of 50. Most people have a little bit of arthritis in their low back. Yeah. And that's where the rub comes that if you do a heavy Olympic lift, which I consider anything with the long bar, it places those guys and girls at a higher risk for backaches and accelerating the arthritis in their back. Yeah. And so for those part time lifters, right… guys that are in girls that are trying to get into it, or that are just just trying,

Sam Fischer  22:32
being defensive, folks, but I am not a part time lifter, right? I do this four to five times a week. Yeah. I'm an athlete.

22:42
And I have the same discussion with the high school kids. You know, if a young man or young girl wants to go Division One, they might need to do the Olympic lifts to develop the muscle mass, develop the power to compete at a Division five, right? But if your son or daughter is really just into it to enjoy high school sports, the Olympic lifts again, which is a squat, deadlift in the hang clean with the 45 pound bar. It just doesn't make a lot of sense. I think the risk to benefit ratio is backwards.

Sam Fischer  23:15
Interesting. Yeah. Interesting. There’ll be a lot of people disagree with you. But I mean, you're you've seen these cases. So I mean, may do,

23:22
we've done a lot of research on it. I just, you know, the first I'd say 20 years of my practice, we we really focus a lot on the kids, right? And we've done a lot of research on it. And we've published what we, I guess, I feel we've published quite a bit on it. We've got one of the largest databases in the country for pediatric stress fractures. But for the the adults now that I'm at that age, you know, and I'm seeing yourself and seeing friends and families that are our age and older. It's our focuses really now in the past, we really didn't pay that much attention to it. What are guys and girls our age 50 60 70s and 80s What are they doing to share? I had a funny story. One of my patients longtime patients brought me in a box a month ago or a couple months ago into clinic and and he sat down and he said hey, I got something for you. I think you need this. I am not as fit as Sam I don't hit the gym near as often. I open up the box and it was a push up board.

John McClellan  24:25
So it was a foldable pushup board that had basically about 12 different positions. And he looked at me said I think you need to start getting into better shape here.

Sam Fischer  24:39
He likes you…. that's good

24:40
as a long term patient and I think he can look to me and an interesting story. So he's close to 70 in he can do a 200 Push Ups no trouble. It's awesome.

Sam Fischer  24:51
That's awesome. And you can do push ups without hurting your back in proper position and they don't have to be off the floor boys and girls do push ups up box that's no picnic either. Yeah. I think I think to plank position is very good for your back. Is it not?

25:06
It is. It is, I think that you know what I enjoy saying you'll, I'll see patients come into my clinic in their 70s. And we're examining their back. And they're extremely fit and it just knocks you off your I mean, you just you can't believe it when you see a gentleman that's in their late 60s 70s. And they have a six pack abs. Yeah, you know, that very few people ever even come close to in their life. And in I've paid close attention to it. And it's cardio nutrition and a workout program that fits you. You know, it's that consistency of, can you do it 5,6,7 days a week? Yeah, and enjoy the 30 minutes or an hour that it's actually enjoyable and fun instead of a torture, right. And so on the flip side, we want and I know you want the same thing we want guys and girls our age to find a program that they enjoy that doesn't have downtime from injury. Right? And it's it's finding your bumpers of because all of us are made a little different all of us bring different types of arthritis, different types of body styles. And just finding what your I call the the spine, your chassis, what will your chassis tolerate when you're 50 60 70 We're all a little different. But finding that workout programs that fits you so you can do it. Day in day out. Yeah, enjoy.

Sam Fischer  26:33
The key consistency part is the interesting comment about the part timers. Yeah, this isn't this isn't making new year's resolutions and going in January, you know, and do stuff that you don't know how to do. It's about identifying a program that will that is sustainable. And I like CrossFit from the standpoint you can measure success as you go. There's metrics involved with it, and but you're training, you're training full time. And so you are an athlete, you know, and that's, that's one of the hardest things I've come to realize is that I'm an athlete. I must be because I spent a lot of money on chiropractic and deep tissue massage, and you know, I drink cherry juice and I take cold showers and so I mean, I must be

27:18
the only cherry juice for anti inflammatory. Yeah, I do think you know, it's

Sam Fischer  27:24
that good doc. Is that a good thing?

27:26
i Yes, I agree I like it? I just think as you there's this misperception though, that, you know, for those of us in our 50s weight training was squats, deadlifts, and hang cleans. That's, that's what it was in high school. If you went into the gym, we didn't have any of the fancy equipment. No. And it's so it's, you know, in the future, you know, mixing in stretching, you know, we'd see the Pilates, the Yoga, you know, using, you're talking about deep tissue massages, just keeping your chassis going. And doing it in a way where you can continue it day in day out.

Sam Fischer  28:05
Oh, I want to show you something here. We'll probably have to stop. But

John McClellan  28:09
surely things Oh, yeah, they're going oh

Sam Fischer  28:16
my deep tissue massage therapist, noticed a different the ways I've been using it. So

28:21
I think anybody that works out routinely, in our age probably has a Thera gun, or they have a recommended or they have a wave roller or they have, you know, they, it is, you know, all of us at our age have some degree of arthritis. And when you get into the gym, and you're doing your cardio, you're going for your walks. We all wake up with different aches and pains every day of the year. And it's it shouldn't stop you from what you're doing. But on your workouts if there's any injuries that really stop you hard. Yeah, it's time to relook at your workouts relook at the type of

Sam Fischer  29:00
scale back correct word is scale. That doesn't mean you have to stop the workout, but you scale. I mean, yeah, that's what I did for months and months after my injury. You know, which, what does that mean? It means instead of deadlift, I'm doing elevated deadlift with a lot less weight. Or I'm doing a lot of planks or I'm doing you know, whatever if it's push up and maybe it was pushed up, up off a box, I could even do a push up off the floor. So you know,

29:28
you know, it's it's caught my attention. When you go to a gym and you work out with a trainer. Most of the trainers are quite young. Yes. And they don't have

Sam Fischer  29:38
perspective. They don't and i give them perspective. Trust me. I educate them.

29:44
Yeah, no, that's important. I but I do think that at our age, you do have to help educate your trainer. To help them to understand how you're feeling after after the workout. Yes, and not All trainers really understand safe workouts.

Sam Fischer  30:05
I agree 100%.

30:06
I mean, we see it every day in clinic in a, what I'm passionate about if a person is so if they're gonna put the extra time and money into improving themselves, you want to make sure you're putting your ladder up against the right wall. And so when you get into the gym, go slow. Be careful at first, make sure that the workouts Yeah, I remember, you know, it's probably been 15 years ago, several of us joined the gym. And by the end of the year, most of us had to drop the gym because we had injuries that were lasting three months, six months, nine months, you put your membership on hold thinking it'll go away. And I think the lesson learned was, you know, we had a great time the trainers were super great people I loved working out with him. Yeah, super addictive. But I was the wrong age to be in that gym. And and I think

Sam Fischer  31:02
harder, I would argue with you, but go on. Yeah, I think it's a lot of those fighting through the injuries are you you have to don't stop because of an injury but scale back because of injury or modify, stretch or focus on why did why was that injury caused?

31:21
I think in looking back on it, Sam, I think it was when you're truly a full time athlete and you join the gym, you're good to go. When somebody signs up for a gym, and they haven't been there in 10 years, which was my case, and then my colleagues fire Yeah, none of them had been to the gym and probably 10 years. And so it was being naive that you're, you know, 40 50 year old body can just jump right in. And it's, it takes a long time.

Sam Fischer  31:51
So one of my coaches, a professional CrossFit athlete, I mean, somebody who's been to the CrossFit stood on the podium, of the CrossFit Games six times. And he's now 40. And he's making a decision if he wants to compete, he could, you know, but I've watched him- had the pleasure of being able to watch him train for many years, you know, and I've noticed that his stretch time before and after the workout has multiplied significantly in the last seven years that I've known him. And so the older you get, the more I mean, he wants told me for every basically for I need to be stretching, and so forth three times, amount of the time, I am actually working out. And people don't do that. They don't know how to stretch, they don't, you know, they don't know the dynamics that are involved in that and they just jump into it. You can't you just can't you have to take care of your body.

32:53
Yeah, and I agree, I think as you get older, or as the body gets older, that stretching is required for some of the arthritis, you know, some of the lack of healthy tissues that you had when you're younger? Yeah. But what I what I see in my clinic that others don't see is that the body does have a limited number of hours on it, the back does. And so what you what did he (like the heart) Yeah, what people need to be a little careful of is there, I often use the analogy of a light bulb, you know, if you buy a light bulb from Menards, or Lowe's and you sit in the corner and flick the switch, the light bulb in your last real long ends. And so in the workouts, you just got to make sure that that as the workout isn't going to necessarily leave you with a back that won't allow you to do what you want to do as you get

Sam Fischer  33:46
older. And that's that's I had a conversation with the gentleman earlier today. And I said, Because I told how I scaled today. I mean, you know, I am old and there are things I want to do. I just came back from a six day cruise, you know, and I want to travel I mean, if so I don't I don't want to, I don't want to be going through the airport with a cane. So I am mindful that I'm in a different spot. On the other hand, I want to continue to it's a balance and we talked about that before it sort of it's a balance. I also want to have internal bloodwork that's gonna give you know, you know, the actuarial look at and say that guy's gonna live to be 83 or whatever. Good point I'm trying to make. I always tried to make 50 I made 60 Don't worry about 70 later but I've got that you want to have the internal bloodwork too so it's about it's it's a balance I I think if you do nothing here we know we're gonna get into a nice little subject but I think if you do nothing, you're going to hurt your immune system. And there's a reason that some people are in the hospital for with COVID and some arne’t you know, there's a lot of overweight People in this country, and I'm not saying just get you're overweight, you're gonna get COVID or be in the hospital. But I think we've got to pay attention to those things in this country. I mean, and so I, you're not saying don't exercise, you're saying exercise, but be smart. You know, any age you should be smart and be cognizant of, of taking care of yourself and scaling appropriately. Keep moving. But don't. Don't wear out your spine.

35:32
Yeah, it's the, again, just coming back to that analogy of a truck, there does come a point where a truck can't work, right? It can't haul anything, it can't carry anything. And it can't go off road. In a lot of us.

Sam Fischer  35:48
During our life sit there and rust out. You don't though, during

35:51
during our life, there are a lot of people that get to that point in their 70s and 80s, where, you know, they can't walk more than a block, they can't stand more than five minutes. And so knowing that that is kind of the end stage of a back, just, you know, in your 50s and 60s, judging where you're at, you know, how much arthritis is in the back? How much life do you have? And that helps people, it helps guide them on? How aggressive Can I be in the gym? How hard can I work out? I think that's important. Just we see a lot of younger guys in their 60s that they can't stand more than a few minutes. They can't walk a block anymore. I

Sam Fischer  36:32
see people 54 years old, you're 55 or 50. I'll be 54 this year, you'll be 55. You're 55 I see guys our age that can't Yeah, it scares me. Right. That shouldn't be that it shouldn't be that

36:45
well. And obviously, a lot of potential causes, you know, might be a poor heart could be diabetes, obesity, dealer fee from diabetes, I mean, a million. So I'm, I'm really junction. I mean, I'm being very myopic. Yeah, from a spine standpoint, right. But the spine does not age well. And so it's important to, you know, listen to your back. At that point where your workouts are creating a lot of back pain, you know, if people are in that position, taking a look at it, getting it looked at see, you know, how much arthritis is developing, and better understand what your chassis looks like, because there are some workouts that are very hard on the back, that are fine for patients that don't have all those degenerative changes, right? And, and I just when people are putting that much effort into living a better life, I just want to make sure that they get really what they want out of it. Right. And yeah, I think there's a lot of guys our age that finally have the time, they've got the evenings free, you know, and they finally have some friends, it'll meet him at the gym, and there's a great, there's potentially a really great time in life. And I think I just want everybody to, to, you know, decide how do they want the next 20 30 years their life to look right? And it really does matter. What you do, like you said, if you don't work out, yeah, that's, that's gonna end up you're not gonna have 2030 years you aren't? You aren't. And then on the on the flip side, and

Sam Fischer  38:17
working out, by the way, listeners could mean walking five miles a day, right? I mean, that's a great workout. Yeah, that's a great low impact workout, and it'll get your heart where it needs to be. Maybe that's what it is.

38:29
Yeah, simple. You know, when we talk about guys in their 50s, and 60s and girls, again, I bring it back to the truck. If you've drive a 50 year old truck every day, you're very careful about the gas you put in it, you keep you know, the oil and the tires looking clean, you put the truck inside, you don't park it outside of the driveway. And if you think of your body, as a vehicle, the age that you are, it'll help give you a frame of reference of what your workouts should look like. Right. And so I think, and I just see so many people getting what I would consider a wound up in, you know, we're seeing a lot now with, you know, people coming in taking testosterone, you know, and we see some guys in their 70s that are just extremely in great shape. And the future of health, the future of nutrition, the future of workouts. It's extremely exciting. What's coming at us. extremely exciting.

Sam Fischer  39:35
Well, lifespan has gone up probably since you've been practicing. It's probably gone up what six months? I don't know, or maybe a year.

John McClellan  39:41
I'm paying much more attention now that I’m older Sam.

Sam Fischer  39:44
Actually, no, no, I

39:46
know. I try and figure out where I am. I talked to my cardiologist about where I am on that table all the time.

Sam Fischer  39:53
Well, great stuff. I I appreciate the opportunity to talk about it. I am gonna do a quick rapid fire thing that I've been doing with with guests this year if you don't mind because it's just some silly and dumb but it's interesting cuz I learned stuff. So this is rapid fire. You're ready. You just got to whatever come on top of your head we do favorite ice cream.

40:18
Chocolate favorite cowboy. John Wayne.

Sam Fischer  40:22
Nice, favorite Egghead

John McClellan  40:25
Sam Fischer.

Sam Fischer  40:26
I am not an egghead. That doesn't count you're in a good I'm already good. A favorite movie. Oh, wow. I'm getting a good list actually, because other people are naming named movies I haven't seen

John McClellan  40:45
Wow. I like all the Jason Bourne movies.

Sam Fischer  40:48
Okay, cool.

John McClellan  40:50
Does it be my top?

Sam Fischer  40:51
Good deal. Anything else you want to add today? Doctor?

John McClellan  40:55
Favorite High School mount Michael.

Sam Fischer  40:56
Michael. Huh? Are we better the prep? Heck yeah.